Akarpa Lobsang Rinpoche has studied and practiced hundreds of techniques of Tibetan yoga and teaches the trulkhor to Bön and Buddhist practitioners and to broader public all over the world. The story of his life that he agreed to share with the readers of the Speech of Delight shows the uniquely extensive knowledge he has accumulated in this field throughout the years, starting in his own Bön tradition and continuing in other contexts. The interview with Rinpoche took place at Triten Norbutse on February 18^th, 2025; the Anthropologist and Tibetologist Anna Sehnalova kindly translated from Tibetan to English and reviewed the text.

I come from Amdo, one of the three main historical and cultural parts of Tibet: Ü-Tsang, Kham, and Amdo. The area where I grew up is called Ngawa. I come from a nomadic family. When I was a child, my two uncles were monks at Nangzhig, the largest Bönpo monastery in the world, located in Ngawa. The uncles inspired me to follow in their footsteps, and I entered the monastery when I was five years old. The younger of my uncles, Yongdzin Yeshe Gyaltsen, was a great scholar and practitioner. For many years I studied with him and other learned lamas of the monastery. 

When I was eleven, I went with a group of monks to the Murdo mountain in Gyalrong, also in Amdo. For Bönpos, it is a sacred mountain. We went there to meditate in caves and stayed for one year and a half. It was very difficult for me,  I was just a kid, with the needs of a normal kid who wants to play, have friends around and eat normal meals.

Instead, we were living in extreme conditions in caves in deep mountains, with lack of food, bad weather, surrounded by wild animals, and we had to repeat the same practice day after day. All this was very harsh and boring. I dreamt of escaping and going back to the monastery, where there was enough food, warm shelter and friends to play with. But I did not dare to do that alone. After some time though, my attitude toward my practice changed.

A few years later, I went to the region of Sharkhog, also in Eastern Tibet. It is another stronghold of Bön. I stayed in the monastery called Garme Gompa for four years, studying the sutras, such as Prajnaparamitas, and tsalung practices with Yongdzin Yeshe Gyaltsen, who was also one of the teachers of the 34^th Menri Trizin Dawa Dargyal. Yongdzin Yeshe Gyaltsen is a great Dzogchen practitioner. He follows strict discipline and is very knowledgeable. Later, I went to Central Tibet with him. We visited the monasteries of Yungdrung Ling and Menri. Close to Menri, Yeru Wensaka– the first monastery of Yungdrung Bön from the late 11^th century AD – existed, before itwas destroyed by a flood. Prominent masters of Bön used to practice Atri meditation on its grounds. As we did, staying there for a few months and meditating. Again, it was not easy. The climate was harsh, my teacher was fully focused on his practice, and I had to provide food. I went begging in a village nearby, knocking on people’s doors. Sometimes people gave little tsampa or even a bit of meat to me; other times I did not get anything. We lived on very little food.

After, my teacher and I moved to another important place for Bönpos, Kongpo Bönri, a sacred mountain in Southern Tibet. There, the food was much better, and the weather was warm, but it was raining a lot, and my blankets were soaked with water. My main aspiration was to learn and deepen my practice of Dzogchen and tsalung. I was not interested in doing circumambulations around the mountain at that time. I just practiced staying in Takla Mebar’s cave.

One day, after many months, we just came out of a retreat. As we were walking downhill down a mountain, we met an old lady. At that time, we had nothing left to eat. We were exhausted. Still, we had to walk for a few more days. The old lady noticed our exhaustion and warmly invited my master and me to have a dinner in her house. We stayed in her simple house for one night. She made tsampa with butter and fried vegetables. It was the best food I had ever eaten! The next morning she packed a bag of tsampa for us. I will never forget this experience.

After that we returned to Ngawa and I decided to deepen my studies in dialectics. I was strong in debating; I used to be the best debater in my monastery and I looked for further challenges. I decided to go to a Gelug monastery, Amchog Tsenyi Gompa, also located in Ngawa. Its school was renowned as the best for dialectics in the area. I did not speak about my decision with my teacher or family, I went home, stole my father’s favorite motorcycle, and rode for 40-50 kilometers to reach the monastery.

At first, the monastery did not want to accept me, I was only a teenager of 15 or 16 years and coming alone. But when I performed my debating skills in front of a lama, they changed their mind and let me study with them. The monastery only provided teaching, and I needed to pay for my room and board. I sold my father’s motorcycle to pay for my daily expenses. They allowed me to stay in a small space in the monastery which was used as a storage for cow dung. I lived there for about a year.

Afterwards, I went back to Nangzhig and spent many years there, focusing on various texts of the sutras, tantras and Dzogchen. 

In 2001, I went to the Buddhist College of Minnan, a respected institution for Chinese Buddhist education in the city of Xiamen on the Chinese eastern coast. I studied various Buddhist schools at the college and got to know Zen for the first time. My masters said Dzogchen and Zen have similar teachings, and that’s why I was very excited to start learning Zen.  

At that time, I was the only Tibetan at the college. I knew no Chinese, but the monks were very helpful and strongly supported me. I made rapid progress and after a year and a half, I could understand almost everything. After two years, I could give a teaching in Chinese at the college and in some other places. I taught ngondro, preliminaries, basics of Mahayana Buddhism, and meditation.

Many monks who I knew in China belonged to Pure Land Buddhism and Zen (Chan) Buddhism. Zen was my favorite. I used to sit in meditation with a Zen master. We were friends and very close to each other. Although each of us was doing our own way of meditation, our core views on meditation were the same. I drank a lot of tea with him, the green tea typically served during Zen ceremonies. Because of my interest in Zen, later, I went to Japan many times and spent a few weeks in Japanese Zen monasteries. I experienced strict discipline and pure practice there. Not much was said by teachers, no big speeches on advanced theories. It was: just sit. We got up at 2:45 AM every day, and the bedtime was 8 PM.

In September 2005, I went to Beijing, to Peking University which is one of the top universities of China. I pursued my interest in different spiritual traditions and enrolled in comparative religious studies. A student must know three languages to be accepted to the course: besides Chinese, also English, and Pali / Sanskrit, or Tibetan. I did not have sufficient knowledge of English, but one of the Chinese teachers who I met at the university recommended me to his colleagues and helped me to be admitted. For one year, I studied various schools of Buddhism, Hinduism, Christianity, Islam, and Judaism. It broadened my horizons and changed my mind.

I realized that the essence of religious study is to develop oneself to become a better human being; just studying theories without putting them into practice is pointless. With this realization, I left my studies at the university after one year and devoted myself to the practice.

I decided to go to the retreat place of Shardza Tashi Gyaltsen Rinpoche in Kham, which was the most famous Bön retreat center in the region. There, I stayed for a year and dedicated myself to the study of tsalung, trulkhor, tummo and Dzogchen; I spent some time in the dark retreat too. After this, I went back to Beijing. But I had no interest in going back to the university. I also did not want to go back to Nangzhig, my home monastery. I wanted to learn more about yoga and decided to go somewhere far from home.

I once heard there was a group of Hindu yoga practitioners in Kathmandu, and I decided to go to Nepal and study yoga. My cousin helped to find a translator who knew Hindi and I practiced Hindu yoga in a traditional, private yoga center in Kathmandu for a month. The teachings there mainly focused on yoga philosophy and meditation.

One day, a friend who was from Ngawa and lived in Kathmandu asked me, “You are Bönpo and there is a Bönpo monastery here. Did you come to study at your monastery?” I was surprised to hear that. I asked: “Is this the monastery of Yongdzin Rinpoche?” He said: “Yes, exactly!”

I met Yongdzin Rinpoche when I was very young, when Rinpoche visited Nangzhig monastery. During Rinpoche’s visit, my older uncle was one of the four attendants assigned by Nangzhig to support him. My uncle even invited Rinpoche to our home. But I was too young to remember the visit. Since then, my uncle has carefully kept his photograph with Yongdzin Rinpoche and hung it on the wall in our home. Therefore, I had been seeing Rinpoche’s photo since then and remembered his face clearly. Rinpoche is very special to me. He felt very familiar. Even now this photo is still on the wall in the central place of our home. I had also seen Rinpoche many times in my dreams, and his monastery: a small monastery located in the mountains, surrounded by many trees. I located it somewhere close to the border between Nepal and India. I did not know it was right under my nose, right here in Kathmandu. That’s why I did not go to visit it before my friend told me. We decided to go to the monastery, Triten Norbutse, together the next day.

Meeting Rinpoche was like meeting an old friend. Many people feel shy and almost afraid to approach him, but I was not. I was not nervous at all. I felt I could chat with him. I told him, “I am coming from Beijing, and I would like to request Dzogchen teachings from you.” Rinpoche replied, “Dzogchenis not easy and it is very sacred. Students need to meet some conditions before they can receive it. I can help you with anything else you want to learn except Dzogchen.” Rinpoche was 83 at that time. He had been retired for a few years then. Also, his assistants thought he could not teach me, but I did not give up.

In Triten Norbutse, there was a Geshe from Nangzhig who was very knowledgeable, and I used to discuss Zen with him. He said: “You have learned Zen, right? You can talk about the views of Zen with Rinpoche tomorrow. Perhaps that will make an impression on him.” This was a very good idea. On the next day, I immediately said to Rinpoche that I had studied Zen in China. Rinpoche got very interested in it, and we talked for two hours.

At some point, Rinpoche said, “Oh, you understand Dzogchen! Bring the 21 Nails with you tomorrow. I will teach you.” The 21 Nails is the innermost secret teaching from Zhang Zhung Nyengyu. Our study began the next day. That was February 2008. Since then, I spent 3 to 5 months each year studying with Rinpoche for 17 or 18 years.

In all these years, I also continued to learn the trulkhor and tummo tirelessly. I went to Tsangwa Monastery of the Jonang school of Tibetan Buddhism in Dzamtang in Amdo. The 47^th Jonang Trizin Jigme Dorje taught me the Kalachakra tummo and tsalung practices. I received the lineage from him for all the Jonang Kalachakra tummo and tsalung practices.

I also studied the trulkhor of Lamdre, or Path and its Fruits, of the Sakya school with the lineage holder Lamdripa Jamyang Sengge Rinpoche around the same time at the Dzongsar Gagu retreat center south of Derge in Kham, and I received the lineage from him. After that, Rinpoche invited me to go with him to visit monasteries in Inner Mongolia in China to teach the practice of trulkhor of Lamdre to hundreds of Chinese, Tibetan and Mongolian monks. Jamyang Sengge Rinpoche introduced them to the theory in the morning and I led the yoga practice in the afternoon.

Moreover, I traveled many times to Bhutan and received the teachings of the Six Yogas of Naropa there. For five years, I studied different tummo practices with Trizin Ngawang Tenzin of the Drugpa Kagyu school and received their lineage of all the tsalung yoga and Six Yogas of Naropa. I  had retreats in these practices there.

In Bhutan, I further went to the monastery of Shabshog to study the trulkhor of the famous Bhutanese siddha Ringzin Pema Lingpa. By the way, the practices and movements are depicted in the rare murals of the Lukhang temple behind the Potala Palace in Lhasa. At that time, this was absolutely revolutionary: the practice of yoga had been kept secretly only among a few privileged practitioners. There is a book about these paintings by Ian Baker called The Dalai Lama’s Secret Temple.

I also went to the retreat center of Sherab Ling monastery in India and stayed for one month there. I studied the Six Yogas of Naropa with Tai Situ Rinpoche and received the lineage. I also received teachings and lineage of the Shangpa Kagyu tradition in Kham, including the lineage of the Six Yogas of Naropa and the Six doctrines of Niguma.

For the Nyingma tradition, I went to the birthplace of Pema Lingpa in eastern Bhutan, and received all the yoga lineage of this master. I also went to the retreat center of the Nyingma master called Adzom Drugpa, the Adzom monastery in Serta in Eastern Tibet to receive the lineage of Jigme Lingpa and stayed for one summer there. (Note: The monastery is in the region of Kandze in Kham, not far from Derge, and should not be confused with the well-known Serta Larung Gar Academy in the region of Serta further to the East). Furthermore, I went to Nangchen in Eastern Tibet to Tsognyi Rinpoche’s monastery and studied the tummo and trulkhor of Ringzin Rinna Lampa of the Nyingma school. In India, I studied trulkhor and tummo of the Nyingma school at Namdrol Ling. In addition, I went to Italy three times to study Yantra Yoga with Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche and received the lineage from him. He gave me the name Akarpa.

Last but not least, Geshe Phuntsok of the Ganden monastery in India taught me the practices of  Tibetan yoga in the Gelug tradition.

In all these years, I learned around eight hundred different varieties of Tibetan yoga and mastered them in practice. Besides my own practice, now I focus on teaching the yoga to others.

I also learned how to depict trulkhor movements and I dedicate my time to this. Usually, we know trulkhor from descriptions in texts and from oral transmissions, but I have not seen many of those techniques in drawings or paintings. I thus created a thangka center in Kathmandu, learned to paint a bit, and together with a group of artists who are my friends, we focus on documenting all the trulkhor systems in paintings. We have been working on the thangkas for 10 years and still have not finished. My goal is to document the essential practices and movements of all religious schools on the thangkas. If those lineages disappeared, it would be a big loss for humankind.

I quite like to engage in creative and artistic activities. I recorded more than forty Bönpo mantras and the albums are on different music platforms. I made a documentary, and sometimes I perform ritual dances adapted by me for non-Tibetan audiences. They are very popular in Japan.

To help modern people in cities, I developed my own style of trulkhor based on what I have learned from various schools. Students from both the East and the West find the practice helpful. Some people may not like this approach, but I follow the rule “what is beneficial is good.” I spent more than 10 years developing the Himalaya cultural center in Beijing, and I founded Himalaya Dzogchen Ling in Hongkong in 2012. The aspiration is to spread the knowledge of Tibetan yoga outside Tibet. Those practices suit people in modern society very well.

I also teach the practice of Dzogchen. This is based on the Bön tradition. My meditation is purely Bön, unmodified Dzogchen meditation.

Usually, I spend a few months every year in Kathmandu. During this time, I practice in a small place behind the former Yongdzin Rinpoche’s residence in Triten Norbutse. When I am out of Kathmandu, I stay in Beijing and Hong Kong where I established my centers, or I travel for teaching in other countries. From 2009, I started giving classes on Tibetan yoga and meditation systematically. My students are in part Buddhists and in part just common people. Many of them are very successful in their work but experience difficulties and disbalances in their body and mind. In many courses I teach them just breathing exercises, no movements. Besides trulkhor, I teach meditation, including a particular kind of meditation which involves all five senses. Sometimes my students and I do walk meditation.

My teaching for Buddhists is free of charge, and I do not collect offerings in any form. But the application process is selective. I choose students who have significant life experiences, have gone through ups and downs, resonate with the teaching about love and compassion, are able to take responsibility for their own lives, are courageous and able to take challenges. What does it mean to be a Buddhist? It means to challenge oneself to a new beginning. People without courage are not suitable for this path. And my students also need to be a bit crazy, not too serious about life. Life is a game, and it is absurd. So, don’t take it too seriously. Mainly Chinese Buddhists take part in my courses. Some are very serious practitioners, and I give them all kinds of Buddhist teachings.

Instead, I do charge for my classes for non-Buddhists, and the price is quite high. To these, everyone who applies is accepted. I use the money to finance my other activities and to support beneficial activities of others.

I travel to teach around Asia and elsewhere as well. I have been to the United States many times, teaching mainly people of Chinese origin living there. I go to teach in Europe too: Norway, Switzerland, Spain, and France. This year, I will be traveling to Belgium, Germany, France and Switzerland. I teach mainly in Tibetan and sometimes in Chinese. My English is not good enough; I learned it only informally.

This year in June, I will be going to teach at Shenten Dargye Ling, for the first time. I am looking forward to it, but I wonder if in a monastic institution with a strict discipline like Shenten Dargye Ling I will be able to interact with my students as I usually do. My students and I like having fun together. In the evenings, we like dancing, playing, and talking together. We benefit from a relaxed and informal atmosphere.

The title picture: Jitka Polanska
The pictures inside the article: credit to Akarpa Lobsang Rinpoche

The documentary about Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche, the most senior and venerated living master in theYungdrung Bon tradition, is completed now, right for the celebration of his 100th birthday starting in a couple of days. In this interview, taken by Alexandra Forget, Georgina Teran, the producer of the documentary, talks about the motivations behind the huge project and about her connection to Yundgrung Bon. The interview was held in 2018 but was reviewed by Georgina and Alexandra just before being published in Speech of Delight.

Georgina, you’re a very successful film producer from Mexico with business activities in the US, Columbia and in Spain. Spirituality was never a priority for you. What brought Yungdrung Bon into your life?

My ex-colleague Rosa Maria, with whom I had studied at university, called me very unexpectedly one day after almost two decades of no contact. She told me that she had just finished a 49 days dark retreat in a monastery. (It was Triten Norbutse monastery in Nepal.)  She explained that while she was in the dark retreat, she had a vision that I was going to help monks of the monastery with a documentary about their master.

Not knowing any of these particular practices, didn’t you think your friend was a little mad, spending all this time in the dark and speaking about visions? 

 Well, solitary confinement is used as a punishment for really rebellious prisoners, and often, results in the prisoners suffering from panic attacks and hallucinations. So, I thought this practice needed to be very potent spiritually if it gave her the tools necessary to handle such a long period confined alone and in the dark without suffering. I was actually quite intrigued. Then, she sent me a photo of her master Yongdzin Rinpoche. He made a very strong impression on me instantly. I would be working, only to stop and reopen the picture Rosa Maria sent just to see him. I would close it and go back to work, only to repeat the process over and over again. Thus, when she urged me to come to the summer retreat in Shenten in 2013, I decided to go. 

What was your impression when you first met Rinpoche?

Rinpoche told me how important devotion was and I felt a strong sense of longing, when I saw all the practitioners doing prostrations in the Gompa and later chanting the Guru Yoga prayer. However, listening to Yongdzin Rinpoche’s teachings later on during the retreat, it seemed to me that Rinpoche was answering questions I had asked myself throughout my whole life and that really astonished and moved me.

What kind of questions?

Why can’t people be happy? Why are we as humans constantly unsatisfied? Why is there so much discontent and violence in the world, which no political, religious or social institution seems to be able to solve?  Who are the good guys on this planet?

Those good guys you see in the movies that really care about others.

Fundamental questions about life which are also the very foundation of the Dharma : « How to find true and lasting happiness and be free from suffering?»

Yes, indeed. And with that visit I realized that I had finally found « the good guys », those who commit their lives to grow their spiritual knowledge and wisdom to help others.

Yet a documentary about a spiritual master is not the kind of film you usually make. It must have been quite a challenge.

It has been. When Rosa Maria introduced me to Geshe Gelek Jinpa, he told me that they had been looking for someone to do the documentary for quite a while and what an exceptional and important master Rinpoche was. Khenpo Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche, the abbot of Triten Norbutse monastery, was writing the script, but when I looked at it, it seemed very complicated to me, there were a lot of names and locations I didn’t know anything about. Then, there was also the language barrier. Many of the people we were going to interview only spoke Tibetan, Nepali or Hindi. Another problem we thought we were going to have was the difficulty for us and the crew to get access to the monasteries.

How did you solve these problems?

I agreed to make the film under one condition: the team had to be made up of monks and we, the professional crew would follow and film their journey. So we could be sure that the spiritual knowledge and traditions were going to be treated with care and respect. Once Khenpo Tenpa and Geshe Gelek had informed the council members about the project and they agreed it should be done, all the monks and Geshes of Triten Norbutse monastery gave their unconditional support, and so we could go ahead and do it. We invited the crew of monks for specialized training in Mexico. They all learned very fast. The work was complex and intense, but they all seemed to enjoy it a lot, because they were doing it for their master.

On top of that, they were discovering different countries and cultures throughout the course of the documentary and must have gained a lot of interesting experiences?

We traveled to India, Nepal, Dolpo, Mustang, Tibet and many European countries. Geshe Gelek also travelled to Spain and Colombia. In Colombia, we presented the Teaser of the documentary to the film industry. During our stay, we got an unexpected visit from a Colombian producer accompanied by an indigenous princess from the local Muisca tribe. They had heard about our presence and wanted to meet Tibetan monks. They just came to my door and rang the bell.

The princess told us about a very old and famous prophecy which exists all throughout the American continent, from North all the way down to South America. It says, that one day, when the eagle and the condor fly once again together in the sky, the world will find balance. One of the elders expressed that female energy has a very important role in the return of the spirituality.  

What happened next?

They invited us to an important gathering in the mountains of various indigenous tribes who came from all over the American continent in order to discuss matters of that prophecy. They were very happy to meet Geshe Gelek. They told him that it was time for the big mountain of Tibet to reconnect with the big mountain of America. Some of the leaders of these indigenous tribes also attended the presentation Geshe Gelek gave the film industry, in which he spoke about meditation and spiritual wisdom. It was too short, of course, but they wished to learn more in the future.

You might have heard about a prophecy atributed to Padmasambhava, known as Guru Rinpoche,  who lived in Tibet in the 8th century, which says something like: «When the iron bird flies and horses run on wheels, the Tibetan people will be scattered like ants across the world and the Dharma will come to the land of the red faced man». So it looks there are similar prophecies on both sides.

Indeed.

When do you plan to release the film?

We don´t know. There are a lot of factors that impact the release, but we are doing everything we can to give it the best distribution possible. However, a lot of that process is out of our hands. I would be deeply happy if this documentary of H.E.Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche’s life could touch the hearts of many people, touch and inspire and benefit them and maybe, even change their lives, just as it has changed mine.

Georgina, I thank you very much for this interview and wish you and all your team a lot of success  for the release of this documentary which our sangha is very impatient to see.

Thank you!!!

Pictures: courtesy of Georgina Teran

Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche, the most senior living master in the Yungdrung Bon tradition who is celebrating 100^th birthday soon, has changed the lives of many people. Khenpo Gelek Jinpa, the abbot of Shenten Dargye Ling, is one of them. In this account, Khenpo Gelek recalls his first encounter with Rinpoche and connects the awakening of his spiritual pursuits to the inspirational personality of the beloved teacher.

The celebration of Yongdzin Rinpoche´s centenary is coming soon and I take the opportunity to contemplace all the good Rinpoche he has done for me and others.

The first time I heard about him was at the beginning of the eighties. Tension between China and India weakened a bit at that time, more information was passing through the borders; people could send letters to each other. I was a young boy then and I lived in Kham in Tibet with my family. One evening – I have a very clear memory of the situation – my father said at the dinner that Chime Yungdrung was alive, living in India where he had founded a settlement and a monastery. Chime Yungdrung is the name Yongdzin Rinpoche received by his parents. My mother´s mother and Yongdzin Rinpoche´s mother were relatives, they are from the same family, and I remember my mother saying that Yongdzin Rinpoche´s mother was surely happy to have the good news and that she was lucky to have such a great son.

My first meeting with Rinpoche took place some years later, in 1986. I was nineteen years old then, working as a nomad, taking care of the cattle of our family. It was late spring and at that time of the year, villagers usually ask for a ritual to protect their crops. My father told me to come down from the mountains for the ritual. I went and heard many people talking about an important master who was visiting our region, Khyungpo, and was giving initiations. I went to see the master, together with others. It was Rinpoche and I was blown away. Hundreds of people were waiting for him, some crying, some laughing and showing much joy. His relatives were so proud of him, you can imagine.

Shortly before, our village lama told me that I should become a monk. He planted a seed of this thought in me. After I met Rinpoche, the thought became much stronger, and I decided to take this direction in my life. I took basic monastic vows and started studying Bon philosophy with my first master, who was one of the first geshes – graduates from Menri Monastery in Dolanji, India. He taught us very clearly. 

In 1992 Rinpoche came back to Khyungpo for a visit. At that time, I was already a fully ordained monk. During his stay, I and a few other fellow monks decided to follow him abroad. I did not have any other wish than receiving teachings from him, as he was a single lineage holder for some most precious instructions. While Rinpoche was still in Tibet, we set on a perilous journey to Nepal through the bordering mountains. In our group, there were some lamas who distinguished themselves afterwards, such as Ponlop Tsangpa Tenzin, the head teacher of Triten Norbutse, or Geshe Samten Tsukphud, the resident lama at Shenten and others.

We crossed the mountains safely and stopped in Kathmandu, waiting for Rinpoche there. When he arrived, he told us we could not stay with him and should go, instead, to India, Menri monastery, to complete our studies. I was very disappointed. Personally, I had no wish to become a geshe, I just wanted to receive precious teachings from Rinpoche and practice it. I obeyed him, of course, what else I could do, and we went to Menri. But there, my mind was never relaxed. The monastery is great, it gives excellent education, there was His Holiness Menri Trizin Lungtok Tenpai Nyima, but still, I was not happy. We were monks with low status and could not get teachings directly from His Holiness. So, I was thinking: why did I undertake such a dangerous journey, risking my life, if I still cannot study with the greatest masters? 

After two years, I could not go on anymore. I decided to leave the monastery and reach Yongdzin Rinpoche in Kathmandu. I hoped he would not chase me away. Later, the other monks from my group joined me. 

Rinpoche did not say anything. He accepted things as they were. The most beautiful period of my life started. We were there, with him, receiving teachings from him, it was wonderful. Every day we learn and practice. Finally, I graduated at Triten Norbutse and received my geshe degree there.  Rinpoche gave us complete instructions in sutra, tantra and dzogchen, and all the necessary initiations. And not only one time. I think I received Zhang Zhung Nyen Gyud five times, from Rinpoche. Each time, you get more understanding, more clarity. 

I also received personal advice from him on different occasions, throughout the years. I remember it when I feel disturbed. This happens, of course, I am an ordinary being and can feel angry or disappointed or jealous, all these things. Thanks to Rinpoche, I keep focusing on integration of my practice to the difficult moments of my life. Some of his sayings have helped me greatly to pass through hardships. He used to say: “Do not follow people’s mouths. If you do that, you will have to cry hundreds of times because someone said bad things about you, and you will have to laugh hundreds of times, because someone said nice things about you. You will be completely dependent on others. You will not be yourself.”

“Do your best,”  he said, “and don’t worry too much. Don’t expect too much either. What is supposed to come will come. Whatever. Do your best. You cannot do more than your best.” And then he said: “Be honest. Be honest and truthful and transparent.”

And I also remember him saying: “Leave it as it is. Human beings worry often about nothing, we worry about the past, which is not there anymore, we worry about the future which has not happened yet. The past and the future, they are both nothingness. Even if bad things happen, let them go. We can remember them, but we have to let go, not hold on. Otherwise more stress and anxiety will come. Do not chase after the path, do not create the future, keep your mind clear.”

I learned so much from my master. Sometimes he did not fulfill my expectations, and I learned from it too. This is, you know, the biggest instruction.  It happened once that Rinpoche gave us teaching on the outer cycle of Zhang Zhung Nyen Gyud but refused to give us the inner cycle of the teachings. We were already senior teachers ourselves, at Triten Norbutse, and we felt humiliated by this decision. He crushed our egos.

With time, Rinpoche became somehow inseparable from my mind. I bring him with me all the time. His presence, blessings are always with me. I see him around me all the time, really, no joke. I feel so lucky. I’m really fortunate to have spent so many years with him.

I think many people from our sangha feel the same. He has had a great impact on the lives of all of us. That’s why so many people are planning to come to Kathmandu to celebrate Rinpoche´s birthday. It is good to celebrate and commemorate all Rinpoche´s achievements together.

There was nothing before he came to India and Nepal. Now, two great monasteries that he and His Holiness Menri 33^rd Trizin founded preserve and spread the tradition of Yungdrung Bon – dharma teachings, arts, culture – outside Tibet. 

I am very happy that my team and I completed the documentary about Yongdzin Rinpoche last December, just in time for Rinpoche´s 100^th birthday. It was not planned this way, but it happened. Both Tibetan and English versions are ready and will be screened during the upcoming celebrations. I think it is very auspicious.

Photo credit: Khenpo Gelek Jinpa

At some point of his life, Gideon Makin, a fifty year old university lecturer in philosophy at that time, set out on a trip to Kathmandu. He did not know how long he would stay, and it would have surprised him to know that in the end, he would spend six years there, in close association  with the home monastery of his master, Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche.

Usually, I start with asking people when they met Yungdrung Bon. In your case I would be curious about what came even earlier. Are you British, or an Israeli? Where were you born and where did you grow up?

I do not know which one I am (laughing). I was born and raised in Israel. Both my parents moved there from England. We spoke English at home, and I have a family in England to this day. I got my undergraduate degree in philosophy and history in Israel and when I was thirty six, I went to do a doctorate in philosophy at Oxford, in 1990. After completing my degree I got research fellowships and lectureships in various  universities in England and Scotland. I stayed in the UK until 2006. Then I moved to Kathmandu.

Let us say that I see myself as both Israeli and English. When I lived in Britain, I identified myself as an Israeli; in England I could not get away with saying I am English. In Kathmandu, I presented myself as English. I am a British citizen from birth. For this and other reasons it was more comfortable to identify myself as British there, although some people weren’t fooled by that (laughing).

Do you recognize your Jewish identity?

Definitely. My parents clearly identified as Jewish. Not so much as strict practitioners of the religion. Their identity was driven by a sense of belonging to a specific group scattered around the world and not having their own home. A dream to have their own state was very strong among Jews in the thirties when my parents were young. 

What was their life like after they moved?

Very tough. Many of the people who emigrated to Israel at that time left eventually because life there was so tough. It was a poor country, Israel, and people worked very hard, but they were full of idealism.

When did you start being interested in Buddhism?

It was later on, when I completed my doctorate. After a few years of being a researcher and lecturer elsewhere I got a job at the University of Stirling in Scotland. In 2001, Lama Khemsar Rinpoche came to give a talk for the students of the university. I went to the talk mainly out of curiosity. Nevertheless, the lama made a very strong impression on me. But it does not mean I jumped into Dharma right away. He came again the following year and only then I got more involved. There was a group in Glasgow then, six or seven people, all the lama’s students, who met every week to do ngondro, the preliminary practices. I joined them and it brought me into it. If it was not for that I would not have stayed in the Bonpo tradition I think. Such groups are very important, to keep continuity and motivation.

It is quite unusual that an academic approaches Buddhism starting from something so repetitive as the ngondro, isn´t it? 

I was drawn to it but I did not understand much of it. It seems even strange to me, to think about it now, I wonder why I did it and how I found time for it, every day. I do not know. I think a strong impulse for approaching the teaching was the impression Lama Khemsar made on me. He was a person I looked up to. 

The beginning was slow, you said, but already in 2006 you moved to Kathmandu. It looks like an acceleration in your dedication. What took you there?

I wanted to see Yongdzin Rinpoche. He and Khenpo Tenpa Yungdrung came together to Lama Khemsar´s center, near London, and both gave talks, in 2004, if I remember well. That’s how I got to know them. The same year, by the way, I went on a pilgrimage to Menri monastery in India. Lama Khemsar organized a trip with his students to Menri and Sikkim, that year. Because it was during the academic year, I could not go, but I went by myself during the summer holiday, following the same route. So, I developed a connection, but it was anything but “suddenly I saw a light” or something like that; it was quite gradual. 

I went to Shenten Dargye Ling once, to see Yongdzin Rinpoche; I did not know most of the people there. I got to know most of the western sangha members later, during my stay in Kathmandu, when they would come for short visits to see Rinpoche.

Why did you go to Kathmandu, what was the plan?

There was no plan. I just went to see what it was like and to visit Rinpoche. Although somehow, I think, I was ready for the possibility of staying. I kept in mind what Rinpoche told me in one of our conversations. He said: ”Why don’t you come to Kathmandu? Living costs are just one euro per day.” It turned out not to be exactly that, by the way (he laughs).

When my job at the university of Birmingham – my last academic position – ended, I thought: “There will always be time to look for a new job, let us go to visit Kathmandu and the monastery first”.  

When I arrived, Rinpoche was not there. He was somewhere, travelling, and nobody could tell me when exactly he would be coming back. I remember that I was surprised not to find him there. I imagined him being always there except for short periods.

I went to the monastery right from the airport, all excited, and all those whom I met there were very relaxed. “Sit down, no rush,” they told me, “Rinpoche will come maybe in one month”. They seemed to me people from a different planet, or at least a different epoch. 

Did you know where to stay?

I did not arrange anything before but Tsewang, the secretary of the monastery at that time, took care of me, and he found me accommodation. With those people, I felt at home very quickly, or at least very welcome. Geshes did not have their own dining room at that time, they used to have lunch and dinner in the guest dining room, so we guests had meals with them and we spent hours talking. Some of the geshes spoke little English. Tsewang spoke good English and he used to translate.

We had a good time. Lots of Rinpoche´s students came to visit too, for a week, two, three, and during those visits everyone had a lot of time to sit and talk. A bit like here at Shenten, there is time to talk. No one is in a hurry. 

You stayed for six years, in the end…

Yes, I only went once every year to visit England and Israel, for three weeks, and the rest of the time I spent in Kathmandu.

How did you maintain yourself?

I have a small pension. When you find yourself without a job, and are above a certain age, you are given the option of taking early retirement, (in the university’s pension scheme). I was fifty-one then. In  England, that penstion would have been negligible, but in Nepal, it was enough to live on. 

You look like a very regular person, not the kind of person who would go and stay for years in Kathmandu…

Yes, it is a bit surprising for me too. I am not a “new age” type of person at all. 

How did you spend your time there?

I went to the monastery every day. I had lunch there. Not from the very beginning but after a while I started meditating with the monks of the Drubdra group, those who follow a four-year long program and are dedicated mainly to developing their meditation. It was twice a day and those two meditation sessions were the center of my day. There were other things which were interesting and nice, but the important thing about my being in Kathmandu was this discipline to climb the stairs to the monastery every day, at seven in the morning and at five o’clock in the afternoon, and do one hour of meditation there. I did this until my back started hurting at some points which made it impossible for me to sit cross-legged any longer.

I also taught some monks English, there was quite a demand for it among the Geshes.

Did you relate to the fellow monks with whom you meditated or you just joined them for the meditation?

We did not have a common language, but we made some contacts, they were very friendly to me. We used  to shake hands, and they used to invite me to have tea in the restaurant just below the stairs to the monastery. I did not feel alone at all. Of course, I was not one of them but they were very welcoming. I made some friends among them.

I also made a special contact with Ponlop Tsangpa Tenzin Rinpoche, the head teacher of the monastery. He spoke almost no English then, but even without words, we felt sympathy for each other. When he started to come to Shenten, in 2014, I went to many of his teachings there, and finally, I edited a book with his teaching on ngondro, a couple of years ago. 

What did you do in the evenings?

I was at home. Around seven I would come back from the monastery. At that time, during  the winter season, there was no electricity in the evenings. In all Kathmandu there was “power shedding”. There was a table showing in advance which area would have electricity at what hours and which would not. We used candles.

I was full of new impressions collected during the day. Maybe because I was in a different country, and it was the first time I lived in the East, Nepal was very interesting for me. I was just looking to see how people dressed, how they behaved, what they did, just simply going around, only to buy milk, was interesting. 

I spent my evening reading about Tibet but not only, there were and still are good bookshops in Kathmandu. I also worked on some articles in philosophy, which I promised to write before I left. Those years in Kathmandu were productive for me.

Did you experience any shift, development? Anything to tell about?

I think so. For example, my perception of the monastery changed a lot, gradually.

How?

At first, things struck me as very strange, or arbitrary, but with time they became natural and not at all strange. The strong devotion and respect to the lama, for instance, the strict hierarchy and discipline, the way things are managed may be unfamiliar or even strange for a westerner.

Initially, I had the impression that everything was very chaotic, but I gradually came to understand that it is just a different way of doing things. Ultimately they do get things done, but without the fuss… They just organise themselves differently, more quietly than we do. 

Also, our western image of monastic life is of a slow and relaxed kind of existence, but Triten is always bustling with activity. Monks have a lot of duties to fulfill. I had more time to meditate than most  monks would.

What brought the experience to an end?

After six years, my need or interest in living close to the monastery and going there daily faded. I felt like I got all that I could. I went back to England, then to Israel. It took me some time to adjust to a new phase of my life. Then, I began attending retreats at Shenten, from 2013 on. Sometimes, I stayed around Shenten after retreats too. 

Once I came to Shenten just to visit Yongdzin Rinpoche. He  was usually at Shenten from the spring to the summer, even in the periods when there was no teaching going on and very few people were around. I sensed an opportunity and asked if I could do a personal retreat with him, and he said yes. I stayed at the house nearby (where I usually stay whenever I come to Shenten), and met Rinpoche twice a week for about two months. In between I meditated a lot and kept strict silence. I remember I was always complaining to him about my meditation, and he used to say: “Don’t push yourself too hard.”

For me, the priceless thing was to observe a master of Rinpoche´s stature in everyday situations. I think I learned more from that than from teachings. 

What did you learn?

His attitude to things, his neutrality, his genuine modesty, his child-like sincerity, and one thing one does not usually expect from a spiritual master, his being a thoroughly practical person. I had lots of opportunities to observe him already when I lived next to the monastery and went there every day. There were plenty of rituals which I attended, I sat in lots of pujas, getting soaked in the atmosphere. Also, sometimes Rinpoche would give teachings to a small group of visiting westerners, and I joined the group. Other times, I spent time alone with him asking about his life. I recorded many hours of interviews with him. I handed them to Charles Ramble as raw material to use when he was editing the biography of Rinpoche, The life of a Great Bonpo Master. 

Rinpoche is such an inspiring person for me. This is what I expect from a lama, to inspire me. Each time I met him I felt an urge to go and practice, because I want to be as much like him as I could possibly be.

By far the most important opportunity to be close to Rinpoche and be inspired by him was during the tour of Tibet in the summer of 2007. There was a small group of westerners that travelled with him (Florens Van Canstein published a book about this journey), and I had the rare privilege of being among them. 

Phoro credit: Gideon Makin

Olivier Rousval met his master Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche in 1999 in Cergy, a small village situated about twenty kilometres from Paris, where Rinpoche’s teaching was then organized. For the past eight years, Olivier has been treasurer of the Association Triten Norbutse. We asked him about the origin and  activities of the Association.

Before the turn of the century, Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche’s French students used to spend a lot of time thinking about ways to support Bon in France, Europe and Nepal. It soon became apparent that a formal organization was needed to manage retreats and the connected financial flows.

L´Association Shenten Dargye Ling and l´Association Triten Norbutse were both created at the same year, 1999. The former to disseminate the teachings, the latter –  l´Association Triten Norbutse – to support Triten Norbutse monastery, the headquarters of Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche in Kathmandu, Nepal.

Initially, the Association Triten Norbutse helped to meet the living needs of the Triten Norbutse monastic community. In particular, it collected money for the little “monks”. (Technically, the children who live at the monastery are not yet monks. They wear monastic robes, but they take their monastic vows later, as teenagers). The support was conceived as a sponsorship for an individual child at first, but later, it was decided by the Association to contribute to the general budget dedicated to all the children instead.

Gradually, the Association has extended its support to other areas. “We helped with building a new kitchen and we also helped students attending the medical school belonging to the monastery,” Olivier recalls. “Also, after the 2015 earthquake, we helped the monastery to rebuild and repair some of its buildings that had been damaged by the disaster,” he adds.

Among other initiatives, members of the Association organized a public crowdfunding a few years ago for a monk’s urgent operation. Sufficient amount of money was quickly raised.

The Association has around twenty members who make monthly donations.  Other people give occasionally. “We receive donations from practitioners all over the world. Many donors are very loyal and generous,” says Olivier. “It’s not so easy to send money to Nepal as an individual, so I think we’re doing a good service to those who want to help the monastery. We have the infrastructure to do so,” he explains.

The Association allocates the donated money to a specific project to which people wish to help. This might be living expenses of the monks, salaries of the nannies for the little “monks”, or costs of the medical school and clinic that are part of the monastery. “When donors transfer money to us, they specify how they wish it to be used and this is respected,” says Olivier.

In recent years and until now, the Association’s main objective has been to help Triten Norbutse’s abbot, Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche, with the construction of a new multi-purpose building on the monastery grounds, informally called “the temple”. “This is a huge project and the covid pandemic has made it even more complicated and expensive,” says Olivier.

The building contains much more than a temple. At the top a new residence of H.E. Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche will be located. Just bellow numerous teaching and conference rooms have been built. The new, large temple is situated on the ground floor. In the first basement, more rooms have been created where monks and lay people will meet for various events. The second basement contains a kitchen and a refectory.

The construction of the “temple” is now complete, decoration and furnishings are currently underway. It will be presented to the public at the celebration of Yongdzin Rinpoche´s one hundred´s birthday scheduled for early February 2025. Like many other members of the sangha, Olivier is planning to travel to Triten Norbutse for the celebration. It’s the first time he is going. “I’ve never been to Nepal, although I lived for three years in India, in Mumbai, working there for a large French company,” he says.

The Association informs sangha members continuously and as much as possible about the progress of the construction. The board is in contact with the monastery management and with Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche, who is the project leader. The Association publishes a newsletter and feeds its Facebook page, which is followed by 2 600 people.

The Association is managed by a number of dedicated people: Claire Mosser, President; Dordje, Vice-President; Olivier Rousval, Treasurer; Anne Demarty, Assistant Treasurer; Isabelle Martinez, Secretary; and Cendrine Lecaplain, Assistant Secretary. “Serge Thauvin also comes to give us a helping hand,” Olivier says. “Some of us, like Claire or Dordje, often go to Kathmandu, collect fresh news of the monastery’s projects and their progress, and they take photos. Donors want to know what is the result of their donations,” explains Olivier.

Photos: Jitka Polanska, l´Association Triten Norbutse

Martino Nicoletti initially approached the tradition of Yungdrung Bön as a researcher in anthropology. He visited Triten Norbutse monastery in 1990, when there were only rice fields around it and H.E.Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche was living and working there with other monks in very poor conditions. Later, Martino developed an interest in Yungdrung Bön as a practitioner. Now he lives back in his native Italy where he regularly has been inviting Khenpo Gelek Jinpa to teach, and he publishes Bön dharma texts translated from English into Italian in his small publishing house. 

How did you first meet Bön, Martino? Was it through a book, a teacher or your research?

It was in 1990, in Kathmandu, thirty-four years ago. At that time, I was a student in anthropology at the University of Perugia, and I was working on my master degree´s thesis. It was exploring relationships between the Bön religion and shamanism. I went to visit Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche at Triten Norbutse monastery for that purpose. I requested an interview with him and he kindly agreed. We talked not one time, many times, actually. 

You already knew about the existence of Bön?

I was very much interested in shamanism during my academic studies. Beside other things I was studying shamanism in some ethnic groups of Nepal and I found out that Bön also had aspects intersecting with shamanism. 

Many people identify shamanism with Bön but Bön lamas point out that Yungdrung Bön is much more than that. In which area, according to you, does Bön contain spiritual procedures of shamanism?

When I spoke with Yongdzin Rinpoche about this, the shamanistic background of the Bön religion, he often spoke about it as a background of Tibetan culture, not something specific only to Bön, but rather to be common to all Tibetan communities. We could say that they all share this as a heritage.

In the Yungdrung Bön all the canonical works are classified into nice “vehicles” or “ways”. Four out of these nine are called “causal”, which means they depend on a cause. And those contain very similar beliefs, rituals and techniques as shamanism does: divination, therapy, ransom rituals… The remaining five are called vehicles or ways of “result ”or “fruit”. The ninth is the way of Dzogchen, the Great Perfection, which is the teachings received by many western students, which I became very interested in a few years later.

Let us get back to your visit to Kathmandu in 1990. What did the monastery look like at that time?

It was very small, with only a few monks there. Living conditions at the monastery were very poor. And it was not easy to distinguish Yongdzin Rinpoche from other monks.

He was doing the same things that they were doing, no difference. This astonished me because I knew I was meeting a very important lama. Every time I went to meet him, I met a very simple  monk, helpful, overflowing with kindness and patience. It felt more like being in a family than in a monastery. And in relation with shamanism: there were some Tamang shamans coming when I was there. Yongdzin Rinpoche told me they visited sometimes, asking him for some advice.

The monastery at that time was outside the city, right?

Yes, there were just fields all around. Kathmandu was surrounded with ring road and after that you had to walk for about 45 minutes to to get to the monastery.

After some years, you developed interest in Dzogchen meditation, you said,  becoming a practitioner. The dharma world and the academic world often keep distance but you found yourself in both of them.

It is true but I personally did not care much. I had reached a balance within myself of those two aspects and later I left the academic world altogether focusing on practice and independent research. 

When did you start practicing?

It was while doing my first PhD in anthropology which had brought me to Kathmandu once again. I spent several years in Nepal, with some breaks, carrying out my research work about religion, rituals  and myths of the Kulunge Rai tribe of Soluhumbu. Slowly, slowly, I started to become less interested in studying the Bonpo religion and more and more interested in practicing it, especially the Dzogchen meditation. In those periods, I had a chance to get some teachings privately from Yongdzin Rinpoche and they were a real booster for me to practice. 

I remember you did some research about Chöd, didn’t you?

Yes, it was still within my academic work. I researched chöd practice in the Dolpo region of Nepal. I focused on the Chöd pilgrimage practiced in lower Dolpo, making a short documentary about it and I also wrote an essay and published it in English and Italian. We worked together with Riccardo Vrech on this research project. What I was mainly interested in was visual anthropology – using mainly visual means like photography and video for documenting research. We organized some exhibitions about the Chöd in Dolpo in Italy. Khenpo Gelek was present at the opening of one of them held in Rome. It was important for me already then but more and more over time not only research but also to disseminate knowledge about Bonpo culture to a wide audience. Later, I wrote some other works on Chöd and recently I have directed a documentary about Bardo accordion Bonpo tradition for French television. Khenpo Gelek features in this movie. Unfortunately, it is copyrighted so I cannot share it with sangha members even if I would like to.

You moved to France and lived there until recently, right? Now you are back in Italy?

Yes, after twelve years living in France I, together with my French partner, decided to live in Italy and moved there a few months ago. Now I live in Umbria, the region where I was born, close to Assisi, the birthplace of Saint Francis. Khenpo Gelek knows this region very well, he came several times and had very deep feelings connected to this area of Assisi and its surroundings. Sometimes, due to the nature of the landscapes we visited together and their specific energy, he told me he had the feeling of being In Tibet.

When did you invite him to Italy for the first time?

It was about fifteen years ago, I guess, and always in Umbria.  And he was there this year too, in April, to give teachings. 

Are Bön practitioners in Italy united, or rather scattered?

There are a few groups, not a unique sangha, but the number of people is growing. I personally feel a very close connection with Khenpo Gelek and that’s why I keep on inviting him to teach in Italy. Out of the same connection, I decided to build an independent publishing house, a few years ago, called “Le Loup des Steppes” (“The Steppe Wolf”). The name is inspired by the famous novel by Herman Hesse. The aim is to make important Bön texts and essays about Dzogchen available to the Italian public, to people who cannot read in English or French. I closely collaborate with John Reynolds and Jean-Luc Achard publishing their works, and also publish some audio recordings of teachings made during retreats, transcriptions of the teachings by Yongdzin Rinpoche and some traditional manuals of practice (i.e. Guru Yoga, Powa, Yeshe Walmo, Chod, Surchod, Bardo Monlam…). I want to share tools with people about how to practice. It happens often that lamas come, they teach and when they leave, there is no trace left. So, publishing text that help people continue with their practice and develop it is my way to contribute to creating a sangha. 

How many books have you published?

More than twenty titles have been published till now. I started doing it in 2016 in France, this year I moved the activity to Italy. 

Who translates the books, you?

Yes, mainly myself and another dedicated practitioner, Lidia Castellano. She helps when sending it to the publishing house to go on. We are basically the two of us.

How much of your time does it take?

I would say ten to twelve days a month. I do everything by myself, including the paging, graphic design of books, distribution. It takes lots of time.

What do you do to make a living?

I currently teach body awareness and dance-therapy. To develop my work and to fluidly combine my personal background as an anthropologist with the body-based therapy, in 2011, I got a second (practice-based) PhD in the UK in Multimedia Arts. Besides that, in 2004 I started to study Japanese Butoh dance. All these experiences allowed me to directly integrate dharmic activities with my profession and research. All these streams are in harmony with each other.

Photo credit: Martino Nicoletti

Denis Scherbakov is a student of Khenpo Rinchen Tenzin Rinpoche, a resident lama of Yungdrung Bon tradition in Russia who studied at Menri monastery in India. Denis is an organizer and supporter of many activities of his teacher, including a three-year long program of study and practice of tantra and dzogchen for Russian speaking people. He also sponsors a Russian “Drubdra”, an intensive meditation program inspired by those offered by monasteries, covering all costs for seven practitioners who are enrolled in it. We asked him about how both programs are organized. 

Russia is a big country. Is there only one sangha, or are there more communities of people following Bon?

It is not easy to answer this question. I was introduced to Khenpo Rinchen Tenzin Rinpoche, about ten years ago, by people from the Dzogchen Community of Namhkai Norbu Rinpoche. They told me there was a good bonpo teacher living in Russia who gives teachings and is also knowledgeable in Tibetan medicine. 

I offered my help to him with spreading Tibetan medical practices and Rinpoche said to me: “I am a better teacher of dharma than of medical science so if we want to help people let it be in the teaching of dharma.” Rinpoche then wrote down a three year program of study and practice around that time and so in 2015 we opened this program to the first group of people. I was one of those people and went through all the twelve retreats. Since then, we have kept this program going. This year there is the tenth edition.

In 2023, Arta Lama Rinpoche, who is connected with Triten Norbutse Bon monastery in Nepal, encouraged his community of students to follow this program too. As a result, now we are all united through this program and also through other activities included in our project called Pure Lands. I would say we are all now one sangha in this sense.

How is the program structured?

It comprises twelve retreats within three years. Four of them last two weeks. The program is built quite traditionally, but adapted for non-Tibetan and non-monastic participants. Students have to go step by step, in the right order, starting from ngondro, the preliminary practices. After they are trained in powa and zhine, followed by four retreats focused on trekcho. Then teachings on tummo, dream yoga and thogal practices come. It is not possible to take part in the fourth retreat of trekcho if they have not gone through the first three retreats. 

Retreats are shorter than the traditional ones, which means that practitioners have to do major work when they return home. Unlike in the traditional retreats which can last one hundred days, as for tummo for example, students in this program use the retreat mainly to get instructions and ask questions of the teacher. They are supposed to develop their practice according to the instructions before the next retreat comes. Just going to the retreats and not doing anything at home does not make much sense. Well, maybe it is better than nothing but still, the idea behind it is to practice intensively at home in between the retreats. 

How many people have gone through the program till now?

1532 people registered and started and 426 people successfully finished.

Do participants meet offline, or online, or both ways?

The course was held in person in Moscow, St. Petersburg and Novosibirsk before the covid. This year the onsite retreat will be in St. Petersburg, in a retreat center that we built, and people who cannot come can join online. The online version has become more and more extended since 2020 when we all got used to it. More and more people are now doing all their retreats at home and connecting with the teacher through the zoom. And not only people from Russia, but also other Russian speaking people from Kazakhstan and other neighboring countries. 

Does Rinchen Tenzin Rinpoche lead the program alone or do other teachers also come?

It was mainly himself for quite some time but later he was joined by other teachers, some from Menri, some others from Triten Norbutse monastery. All are excellent teachers chosen by him. It is very interesting to listen to how the different teachers expose the teachings. Also, because of this, some students who have already gone through the program may sit in on these teachings again. They can do so by paying only symbolic money. 

I heard that last year you opened another, an even more in-depth program. Can you tell me something about it?

Yes, it is a four-year long “drubdra” – a meditation school designed similarly for those set by monasteries. A chosen group of seven people fully dedicate themselves to the study and practice. They live in our meditation center near St.Petersburg. They practice six days a week, one day is free. The first year they went through ngondro according to Zhang Zhung Nyen Gyud dzogchen cycle. 

They all have gone through the three-year course program. Now they are in the drubdra, and if everything goes well, they will get two more additional years of training. All together it will be nine years of studies and practice which will qualify them as teachers. Khenpo Rinchen Tenzin Rinpoche said to us: “If you want Bon to put down roots and spread in Russia, you need to grow your native teachers who speak Russian.”  And so we do.

The practitioners visited Triten Norbutse this year to receive blessings from His Excellence Yongdzin Rinpoche, and then continued their journey to attend the Drubchen at Menri Monastery in April. 

How do they sustain themselves? Does the sangha help them, somehow?

I cover most of their living costs – having a business in logistics. Other people also contribute, according to their possibilities.

Not only those practitioners, but a large group of Russians took part in the Mendrup ritual last April at Menri Monastery. You were also there, I saw you in the pictures, with your wife. I also knew you both were mentioned as major sponsors in the official materials from Menri Monastery.

Yes, I could come for the closing part, not before. From Russia, there were many people, that is correct. We had a presentation of our activities to His Holiness 34th Menri Trizin and we also performed, on the eleventh day of the Drubchen, a tsok to Sipe Gyalmo by ourselves. It was the first time in its history that lay people had performed a tsok in the monastery.

You surely know Shenten Dargye Ling. Years ago, several dozens of Russian practitioners were coming for a few consecutive years to receive teachings from Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche. The group was led by Khenpo Arta Lama Rinpoche. 

Sure, I know of Shenten Dargye Ling, but I have not yet been there. With great pleasure I will come to visit, if there is an opportunity. Talking about this, it comes to my mind that not long ago, we established a cooperation with Dimitry and Carol Ermakov. They did many valuable transcripts of the teachings of Yongdzin Rinpoche which took place at Shenten Dargye Ling and now we together try to make them accessible to our Russian practitioners. I think four publications have been released. There is not much dharma literature available in Russian as in English and so lots of work still needs to be done here in Russia.

The website of the Russian sangha https://bon.su contains beside other information also articles about different aspects of Bon and the editors also translates and publishes chosen articles from Speech of Delight.

The presence of practitioners from Mexico always makes retreats at Shenten full of joy and warmth. Blanca, Sharo (Rosario), Adriana and Celina, all Mexican ladies who are followers of Yungdrung Bon, attend the summer retreats at Shenten. We had a conversation with them last year and brought it up to date now.

Sharo is originally from Chihuahua but now lives in Valle de Bravo. Until last year, she was a caretaker of The Great Stupa Bon for World Peace for six years. 

Blanca comes from Zacatecas in the central part of Mexico, but she also lives close to the Great Stupa. 

Celina is from Nuevo Laredo, which is situated in the northern part of Mexico and very close to the border with the United States. She now lives in the United States.

Adriana lives in Mexico City.

The ladies remember that Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche, together with Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche, came to Valle de Bravo already in 1995. Blanca met them at that time. “They performed a very beautiful ceremony, but then I forgot about the event – I did not know them then. Only later a friend reminded me that I was also there. After some time, I attended Lama Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche’s teachings and I then also received a teaching about the preliminary practices, ngondro, from Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung,” Blanca says. 

Adriana was first introduced to Bon when Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche was teaching in Mexico City, twenty years ago. Celina too had been a student of Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche before she came to Shenten. “There were his teachings in Valle de Bravo taking place already at the end of the 1990s. The land for the stupa had been there but nothing had been built yet. There were only a teacher and students, and everyone slept in tents,” she recalls. “If I remember wel – and I may not – the first teaching was on Chod,” Celina says. 

Valle de Bravo is a place with very beautiful nature and it is a popular holiday destination for many Mexicans. Now, it is also known for the Great Stupa Bon for the World Peace. Its construction began in 2003 and it was completed in 2010. In 2010, it was consecrated by H.E. Lopon Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche, Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche and Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche. 

Blanca, who lives close to the stupa, had been hosting many teachers at her home throughout the years. “She took care of all of them, for many years,” Celina says. Nowadays, lamas can stay in the facilities on the land of the stupa.

Sharo, who started following Bon nine years ago, became the main caretaker of the place after two years she became a Bonpo. She was helped in this task by a team who was in charge for maintenance of the place.  

 “There are two kinds of visitors to the stupa. The first group are tourists who are just curious. The second are spiritual visitors,” Sharo says. She explained the meaning of the stupa to both groups and gave them the background of why and how it came into existence. “Even those who did not know anything before their visit, often leave with something positive, uplifting in their minds. They look different, smiling and happy,” she says. 

“I explained to them that the stupa is exceptional both for its dimensions and because it has a meditation hall inside. Two hundred people can stay within, listening to the teachings, meditating. Every Sunday, there are meditations in the stupa, led by resident lamas, lama Kalsang Nyima and lama Yungdrung Lodoe,” Sharo says.

There must be approximately five hundred Bon practitioners in Mexico, the ladies estimate. A quite big group of them has  been coming regularly to Shenten. “For the Grand Ceremony of Dutrisu in 2018 we were more than fifty, and at the summer retreats maybe twenty to thirty people used to come, even if flight tickets are quite expensive,” says Adriana. More than thirty people went to take part in the ceremony at Triten Norbutse monastery in Nepal, the seat of their beloved Lopon Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche, in 2020, and many are planning to come next year to celebrate their master´s 100^th birthday.

The love that Mexican students have for Lopon Tenzin Namdak is reciprocated by him. “Lopon likes the Mexicans for their strong devotion,” Adriana says. “There is a connection.” 

“I think for Mexicans it is very natural to live this connection with the teaching and masters in a similar way the Tibetans do,” Celina says. “We know that monasteries and lay followers need to support each other; monks work for us with their prayers, and we help them to keep going. Lopon told us that he really appreciates Mexican sangha for being so generous and open-hearted.”

Mexico is a catholic country. How do the relatives of these practitioners see their adherence to a completely different religion? Blanca comes from a very large family, she has fourteen brothers and sisters. “My father studied in a catholic seminar when he was young, and still, he has respected my choice since the beginning,” Blanca says. “You follow what you want, he told me,” she says.

“My parents passed away but my children (I have a daughter and a son) they both are okay with what I do and follow. They see it is as a good path,” Sharo says.

Adriana says that she was looking for some meditation technique because her husband was sick with cancer. “I wanted to learn meditation to help to heal him, as it is said in many books that meditation is good for that. He did not start meditating but my life was changed. My family does not have any problem with what I follow. If you are happy like this, go for it, they say,” Adriana says.

“My mother was against it,” Celina says, “but after time she has changed her mind. She told me she could see good changes in me.” 

When you ask the ladies how it comes they always look happy and cheerful, they say: “It is because we are so lucky. Lucky to be with our masters, to receive the teachings, to have met Lopon. In any case, many Mexicans are like us,” they add, laughing. 

Photo credit: Ligmincha Mexico, Sharo Maldonado, Angel R Torres, Jitka Polanska

Soon, another three-week summer retreat begins at Shenten Dargye Ling. Khenpo Gelek shares his memories of past summer retreats, when they were blessed with the presence of Yongdzin Rinpoche, his root master. “It is important to carry on Rinpoche´s legacy, to celebrate it every summer with a gathering of us, his students,” he says.

Khenpo la, you are now in Mexico and finalizing the documentary movie about your root teacher, Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche. What held you back from doing it earlier? It has been put on stand- by for years…

There is more than one reason. The covid slowed down everything, then I struggled a bit to get a visa, and then we needed to coordinate among all members of the team to be available at the same time. It was not easy.  Also, I wanted to go very much to visit Tibet, and had been waiting a long time to get a visa to China. Finally, I got it and could see my mum. That’s also why I did not travel very much for teaching last year.

Soon you are going back to Shenten, to be there for the summer retreat, as every year. What does that event mean for you?

For me, it is a totally special event. Shenten is a place where I have spent a large part of my life, next year it will be twenty years since the “ling” was founded. For all of us, students of Yongdzin Rinpoche, it is a dharma home, a place blessed with his presence. But it is always open for newcomers too, for everyone who wants to approach Dzogchen meditation or is just curious about Tibetan traditional culture.

How would you describe the traditional summer retreats at Shenten Dargye Ling to someone who has never been there?

It is not just a regular teaching on something. The retreat was established as a part of the enlightened activities of my teacher, Yongdzin Rinpoche, here in the West. Although he had started coming to Europe many years before Shenten was founded, Shenten became his seat, the place of his residence. For many years, until 2018, he spent several months of each year there. 

The summer retreat was a main gathering of the year – many, many students were coming to be in his presence and listen to his teachings. For Rinpoche, it was very important that practitioners of Dzogchen meditation in Yungdrung Bon tradition had a place where they can stay together for longer periods, for teachings and practice. That’s why he also, together with Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche, designed the Gomdra. It is a unique in-depth four year meditation program, which has been held at Shenten since 2009.

For Yongdzin Rinpoche, building a center in the West became a priority in 2001, Florens says

I have been coming to Shenten since 2011 and I also have many memories of Yongdzin Rinpoche, during those summers. He taught exclusively Dzogchen meditation.

Yes, Rinpoche was convinced it was the most suitable spiritual path for people who live in the West. In all those years, he completed teaching on all of the major four dzogchen cycles: Zhang -Zhung Nyen Gyud, “Atri” system, Drakpa Korsum, and Yetri Thasel. By the way, Yetri Thasel will be the topic of the next Shenten Gomdra, beginning in 2025.

And it was not ordinary teachings! Rinpoche is an ocean of knowledge, he could teach entirely from his experience, but he always taught from the original texts, and in the traditional way. He holds the full and complete knowledge of Yungdrung Bon tradition, and he did not make it less so for Western students. He transmitted it fully and thoroughly. Instructions, transmissions, initiations – all were given properly and completely.  He really believed in the capacity of his western students. And I think it is very important to carry on Rinpoche´s legacy, to celebrate it every summer, gathering together as a community. 

There were also many precious moments outside the teachings. I remember that late afternoons – evenings, Rinpoche used to be outside, people sat around him, asking him questions, listening. I remember Rinpoche laughing and saying: “I like chatting.”

For many years he was going to the Longére, in the afternoon, to hold individual interviews with students. It is the building next to the chateau which we recently renovated with the scope to welcome people for longer individual retreats. 

People could come to Rinpoche at any moment, to talk to him, to greet him. He was and is very open and friendly; he likes talking about daily life situations. He is not the one who would tell people to run away from life. He always spoke about integration of the practice into everyday life.

People often say that getting so close to such a great master was a blessing for them. They say that Rinpoche was always strikingly available.

Yes, you could meet Rinpoche anywhere around Shenten. I have collected so many impressions. Now, when I am at Shenten, I see Rinpoche everywhere, in every corner, in all ten directions, we can say. Seriously. Those are very vivid memories for me. It makes Shenten very, very special.

Photos: Christophe Moulin

Geshe Samten Tsukphu learned various calligraphic styles of writing at a young age and can reproduce many different scripts. Shenten Dargye Ling asked its resident lama to lead a workshop on Tibetan calligraphy for those interested in learning the basics of this contemplative discipline.The seminar is going to take place in the month of June.

Geshe la, what are you going to teach the participants at the workshop?

To people who are interested in Tibetan calligraphy, I would like to show the two main types of script – which we call “black” and “white”. How they look and how to write them. Within both categories there are many writing sub-styles, but I want to keep the workshop simple, and will introduce only one example of each category.  

How many writing styles do you know and can perform?

Quite many. More than one thousand.

Really???

Just joking (Geshe la is laughing).

You remind me more and more of Yongdzin Rinpoche, there is a certain way of speaking and behaving that is common. Maybe not everyone knows that you are a relative of our root master, H.E. Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche…

Oh! Good! (Geshe la is laughing). You put what is necessary in the interview, and what is not you please remove.

I would like to keep your jokes though. Now, back to the topic of calligraphy. Can you explain to us the “white” and “black” scripts, what is the main difference?

White calligraphy is called yig-kar in Tibetan, “yig” means a letter, “kar” is karpo – white. The white script is the one that is most familiar to Westerners, and it is also more commonly used among Tibetans. Scholars, Tibetologists, also usually know the white script. Not many of them know the black style. They need to learn whatever is more usable for their research. In the “Western style” books written in Tibetan, we use the white script. 

We call the script “white” because there is more space within the letters. Letters in the “black” script, on the contrary, are more compact. Black script is often used in calligraphy. Also, small children are sometimes given a task to reproduce this script because it is more like drawing than writing and it functions to train their focus.

Your online magazine, Melong Yeshe, written in Tibetan for the worldwide Tibetan public, is written in white script, right?

Yes.

An interview with Geshe Samten Tsukphud about the Melong Yeshe

https://speechofdelight.org/geshe-samten-tsukphud-we-wish-melong-yeshe-have-qualities-of-mirror-like-wisdom/ 

So, do I understand well that the black calligraphy is more decorative, ornamental, and artistic?

Yes. We can find it in the ancient “pecha” books  – the Tibetan traditional blocks of separate sheets of paper wrapped in a textile. Most Bonpo pecha books are written in the black script. Nowadays, it can also be found on prayer flags, for example, it is used in woodblock printing,  as I think this script is easier to carve on wood. 

Is Bonpo way of writing different?

We believe that both the white and black scripts came to Tibet from Zhang-Zhung. We have studied some Zhang-Zhung scripts, and they also had black and white styles.  Bonpo culture is connected to the ancient culture of Zhang-Zhung. We believe the script used in Tibet was created earlier than the 7^th century.

How did you learn Tibetan calligraphy?

In my village school back in Kham where I grew up, I started to learn the white style. By myself, I got interested in the black calligraphy a little later.  I studied different styles of black script and trained to reproduce them. I wrote down many prayer books in a calligraphic manner.

Is it possible to learn Tibetan calligraphy for a Westerner who does not know the Tibetan language, at least to some degree?

Well, the best way is a natural way of learning, just by seeing and trying. If you start to concentrate too much on all the rules that exist for writing, you get blocked, you will lose your natural flow. There are lots of instructions to follow but I think the best is just to relax and learn naturally. 

During the June seminar, people will be able to observe me and then try themselves, at their own pace and according to their abilities. They will get familiar a little bit, both with calligraphy and with Shenten, which is a really beautiful place and good for meditation.

It is a bit surprising to me that people want to learn calligraphy and not meditation. But it is true that calligraphy is a contemplative activity. It has a positive effect on our mind, and it helps it with focusing. I use it to rest and relax.

Photos: Jitka Polanska

“Bonpo scriptures say that the Tibetan writing system came from the forty magical letters of Zhangzhung: thirty consonants, six vowels, and four pronunciations.” 

From A New Look at the Tibetan Invention of writing by Sam Van Schaik

about the workshop:

Tibetan Calligraphy with Vinaya Khenpo Samten Tsukphu (June 16 – 21, 2024)

Tibetan calligraphy is more than a visual art; it is a spiritual practice and a form of meditation in motion. Each stroke and form in Tibetan writing carries deep spiritual and aesthetic meaning. This ancient art is a way of expressing and preserving sacred teachings, offering a window into the rich culture and spiritual heritage of Tibet.

In this seminar, you will explore the basics of Tibetan calligraphy, including its various forms and styles. Vinaya Khenpo Samten will guide participants through fundamental techniques, allowing everyone to connect with this unique form of artistic and spiritual expression.

Whether you are a beginner or experienced in the art of calligraphy, this seminar offers a wonderful opportunity to learn and practice under the guidance of an experienced master. You will not only develop calligraphy skills, but also a deeper appreciation for the meditative and contemplative dimension of this art.

“We have now a place at Shenten ideal for people who would like to practice skygazing and sungazing, in the similar way as they come to do a dark retreat,” Khenpo Gelek Jinpa, the abbot of Shenten Dargye Ling, says. It is the same place where Yongdzin Tenzin Namdak Rinpoche, the founder of Shenten, used to have interviews with practitioners, for many years. It is freshly renovated and it has got a name. “Last time I was in Kathmandu I asked Rinpoche to give it a name, and he kindly called it The Treasury of Instructions,” Khenpo Gelek says. He himself put lots of his work into the renovation of the building, together with a team of sangha members. Other people from the sangha supported the project, which cost around 40 000 EUR, with donations. A lovely small apartment was created in the building. It contains a kitchen, two rooms and a bathroom, and is ready to host practitioners.

“Many people come to Shenten for a dark retreat, and I think it would be very beneficial to come also for a retreat dedicated to skygazing and sungazing,” Khenpo Gelek explains while we are sitting at the side of the building of Longere, adjacent to the main building of the Chateau and facing east, toward Shenten’s small lake.

“Skygazing is different from being in the dark though,” Khenpo Gelek explains. “The senses are not completely free from objects of seeing and hearing and therefore the challenge of integration comes into place. Integration is very important in Dzogchen practice,” he continues his reflections. “Skygazing is therefore a very powerful means of integration,” he says.

The Longère: a top retreat place to become. Update on renovation

Then he leads me to the apartment which he himself and other sangha members created with the aim to offer a place to people who would like to spend some days or even a month in a beautiful environment conducive to practice.

“Khenchen Rinpoche practiced some mornings outside there, doing skygazing, facing the sun rising above the lake. He said afterwards that the place was perfect for that practice, nothing more was needed,” Khenpo Gelek recalls. 

A kitchen, two rooms with wooden furniture and sacred images on the walls, a comfortable and nicely decorated bathroom – this is the place called The Treasury of Instructions by Yongdzin Rinpoche. “When I was in Kathmandu, I asked Rinpoche for a name, and this is really a beautiful one. I think that we all are treasuries of instructions, containers of teachings,” Khenpo Gelek says. 

Some people may want to practice on their own, other people would wish to have guidance from lamas. “Many seasoned practitioners already know the instructions but for whoever needs them, lamas of Shenten would be here to share them and guide the practitioners in their retreats,” Khenpo Gelek says.

“Shenten was meant to have two functions by Yongdzin Rinpoche: preserving the ancient tradition of Yungdrung Bon and offering a place for a community of dedicated practitioners to develop themselves spiritually. The place was blessed by his presence for long years and it is really extraordinary, so beautiful to be here, to practice here,” Khenpo Gelek says.

Individual retreats with skygazing? Will be possible

Photos: Jitka Polanska

Marc has spent most of his adult life with Bon and many people see him translating teaching at Shenten Dargye Ling. “I put my heart in it, trying to keep people inspired with all means at my disposal,” he says. 

Marc, when did you come to Shenten for the first time?

I think it was in 2006. I was not there in 2005 for the first retreat after opening the center, but I went to retreats with Yongdzin Rinpoche in Vimoutiers and Paris before. I met Rinpoche in the autumn in 2001 in Paris, during a weekend teaching. I remember it was extremely cold and I also remember a very clear, blue sky above Paris. I had been already involved in Buddhism and Dzogchen, but mainly in the Nyingma tradition. My first contact with an actual Tibetan Lama  was with  Dzongsar Jamyang Khyentse Rinpoche. 

The filmmaker?

Yes. I  attended a general / public talk he gave in Paris. Then the first “traditional” teaching that I received was from HH  Sakya Trizin, the head of the Sakya school, then I studied with Sogyal Rinpoche who had his center, Rigpa, in Paris. The translator of Yongdzin Rinpoche at that time, François Calmès, who was also active at Rigpa, spoke very highly about Rinpoche and this brought me to Bon.

Quite some time ago…

I am forty-two now so yes, half of my life has passed since then. There was somebody new who came for the teaching last summer and he was somewhat “impressed” by how long my friend and I had been following the teachings, but, to speak the truth, we were actually a bit ashamed that we  were still so ordinary after so long ! (laughing). But it depends on the perspective from which you look at it. I can see benefits of the teaching on myself, definitely.

Could you be specific about the benefits?

I used to be melancholic. Sad. There is a famous poem “The rose is without why; it blooms because it blooms, It pays no attention to itself, asks not whether it is seen” – and so was my sadness,  I felt it without any obvious / tangible reason. From one point of view, everything was just fine and yet, there was a “blanket” of sadness which made my life not enjoyable. It hindered me in my actions, blocked my initiative. Everything required lots of effort to be done, or at least this is how I felt. The teaching and the practice helped me a lot in dispelling this obstacle. Now I am much more at ease and at peace. Life flows more easily. Nothing very profound or mystical, I would say, but my life has improved. I attribute it to the effect of the teaching even if, in part, of course, it could also be just maturing from what is a mindset of a young person. But I know people who are getting melancholic with aging and I think the teaching saved me from that tendency. I can feel I am on the right track.

Do you remember your first impressions of Shenten and its community?

Yes, it felt simple and relaxed, compared to other Tibetan Buddhist communities that I knew, somehow heavier and more strict. There was a kind of atmosphere of ease. Of course, nothing is ideal, there were problems too, people sometimes argued, but in general, it was more informal and simpler. It was also smaller, which does play a role. The community counted one hundred, one hundred twenty people, maybe, which meant we could have a better access to the teachers, and this felt priceless, especially coming from other sanghas, which were much bigger.

You seem to me to be quite familiar with the Tibetan language. Since some time you have been translating teachings at Shenten and I noticed that you can easily catch key words in Tibetan… 

Yes, I did three years of Tibetan studies at the university, as a young man, more or less contemporarily with my engagement in the opera singing. My professional life has been quite diverse and changed its course  several times.

When and where you trained as an opera singer?

In the conservatory in Paris, the period was 1999 – 2006 . There I also started an embryo of a beginning of a career but then I stopped. Too  much pressure, and also I felt as if my butt was sitting on two chairs, as we French say. The other chair was my aspiration to dive deeply into my practice. I was even attracted to monkhood. I was torn apart with those two contrasting inclinations: a passion for music and longing for a spiritual life, on the other hand. And the fact is that I have never gone one hundred percent in one or the other direction. I mean, I became a singer and the beginnings looked promising, but I did not give myself to it fully and completely, because it felt somehow pointless. I could not go “all in”, as they say in poker. Opera singing is a highly competitive thing – you cannot be there without engaging fully. It can be very stressful too, so at some point I stopped, it was in 2009. 

Did you continue your studies of Tibetan language and culture?

I did not complete the course and, therefore, obviously, did not obtain the bachelor’s degree. I somehow could not see myself in academia. So it happened that I have no university degree; although the diploma I received from the conservatory is highly respected within the fields of music and dance, it is not equivalent to a university degree.. And when I stopped doing music, it was a little complicated because, from an academic point of view, all I have is my high school diploma. 

I am curious to know what happened then.

I have always been interested in human science, and studied economics as an autodidact.So I decided that I would try to get work in finance. Without a proper diploma it was not that easy, but I managed my way through. My entry point was through sales. I was calling people and offering them investments, but I really did not like that. Luckily, I managed to move into the advisory field and worked as a wealth manager, for people who are well off. Not only did I enjoy it much more, but I could also apply what I learned in the arts. When done properly it can be a holistic job, not just about finance: you take into account the family situation, personal objectives, preferences… Also, the quality of the relationship matters a lot. I did this for four years and stopped when I divorced.

From whom?

I was married to a musician. I was young when we met, and she was even younger. After I interrupted my musical career, I looked for jobs which could provide for both of us, and from that point of view, finance looked like a good choice. When I divorced, there was only one mouth to feed, and this granted me more freedom. And I moved back to music. First, as a piano and singing teacher for children, and then going back on stage; not in classical music anymore,  instead, I performed a “jazzy” repertoire in five star holiday resorts in Bali and Mauritius where I grew up. Later on, I had the opportunity to get back to classical music, especially operettas.

In Bali you met your current wife, right?

Yes, I met Mandana there and we married after seven years of being together, in 2022. . At the time, I was only traveling in Bali, and she was already living there. I moved there a few months after we met, and started working in Bali. It went quite well for a few years,  until covid erupted. As tourism came to a complete halt then, I lost all my contracts in entertainment. Everything was frozen. Anyway, at the time, I was actually already planning to stop working in the resorts and move back to classical music. It would have been tough, but not impossible. I would have aimed at singing in some smaller, provincial opera houses. With covid, I got more immediate preoccupations: I was left without any financial means. As a freelancer I did not get any compensation, neither from a company nor from  the government. But I was very lucky to have my family. We stayed with my parents in Mauritius for quite a period. 

You developed a new profession during the pandemic, as far as I know.

Yes, the situation was not a joke, but I took that challenge as an opportunity. I had a roof above my head, at my mum´s place, and so I dived into studying computer science, by myself, from scratch. There is actually lots of amazing material online, made by prestigious universities, most of them for free.  I managed to be disciplined enough to create a personal curriculum and follow it. 

What kind of job did it bring to you?

Now I work as a data scientist, in the field of machine learning and AI. I work for a startup in Mauritius. In order to generate some cash flow while we develop our core product, we do some “data consulting” on the side: creating data pipelines and doing some analytics and data mining as we call it. But the core project is to develop what is known as a “Recommender System” powered by AI, which would help small retailers to boost their business, by telling their customers what other people with similar profiles bought. This is how a big part of sales on Amazon works. I do like the job, but I would like to reach an area where I really can make a difference, using data and AI to do something more socially useful, maybe to help fight cancer or global warming.

Or fighting artificial intelligence, no? Isn´t it threatening to make many people lose their jobs and bringing other big dangers?

No, I think we that should not fight it, but rather find ways to work with it, leverage it. Otherwise, I would not do that job… So, that´s where I am now. I have finally a job that I can do from anywhere as I have always wished. But I am paid in Mauritius rupees now which is not the strongest currency in the world, and this come with its limitations. My goal is gaining enough expertise to become a consultant, working on my own, and be able to live in nature, maybe in the mountains, working a few months a year and dedicating the rest of my time to practice. Leading a very simple life, with the luxury of free time, in natural surroundings conducive to practice. 

Your English is so good. Is it due to the opera singing?

Probably. Languages are a form of music, I guess. I have been exposed to many languages when studying classical signing. Also, Mauritius is a former British colony. An average Mauritian person speaks much better English than the average French person. 

I cannot detect a French accent.

I can speak with a French accent if you want. I can do it (imitating it).

At some point you have become one of the translators for the teachings organized by Shenten Dargye Ling.  In particular, you translate Khenchen Tenpa Yungdrung Rinpoche´s teaching. Do you remember your first translating experience?

I think it was still at Rigpa in Paris, and it was not a live teaching, but a replay of a teaching which I translated in French. You know, if you are a singer, it helps, you know how to work with your voice…

Your voice is pleasant to hear…

Thanks, but it is not only a matter of having a good voice, but also being used to being “on stage”, using your voice and body, not being shy etc…

Have you ever translated for Yongdzin Rinpoche?

Never, or maybe for five minutes, an informal talk. That would have been another story, because we must admit that Rinpoche´s English is very personal and not easy to translate.

What was your first translation – or more precisely interpreting, to distinguish it from written translation – for the Bon community?

My first time was translating  Khenpo Gelek during a weekend of teachings in Paris. Long time ago.

How was it? Khenpo Gelek also uses English in his own way.

Yes, it was probably a bit harder than translating Khenchen Rinpoche, but much easier than translating Yongdzin Rinpoche. 

How long have you been translating Khenchen Rinpoche´s teaching?

Ten years I would say, more or less. We should ask Christophe to check.

You are quite familiar with the subject, you know many Tibetan dharma words…

When I was younger, I was quite “obsessed” with studying the teaching and I used to read many, many books, and this helped with the learning structure and vocabulary of the teachings. It obviously makes translating easier. And I also had this friend, Francois, whom I mentioned earlier. He translated for many lamas. I could flood him with all kinds of questions regarding the teachings. I also had the chance to discuss lots of things with Philip Cornu and Stéphane Arguillère, both highly knowledgeable scholars who translated texts of the doctrine. Stéphane actually translated Yongdzin Rinpoche after Francois. Both were generous enough to bear my endless and various questions. 

Lately, the translation has been shared between you and Dominique, Yungdrung Tenzin. You both have a very different, very personal style of translating. 

I would say that I am humbly trying to follow the lineage of Francois Calmes. He was really impressive as a translator. He could sit, not taking a single note, with Yongdzin Rinpoche speaking for ten minutes, and then was able to reproduce it perfectly. I was often inspired by his translations, as he made things clearer and more alive for me. 

There is a dilemma which  all translators face: whether to stick to the letter or to the spirit of what was said. And I have always leaned toward the latter: preferring translating the essence, the spirit, to a word-for-word translation. With this, of course, you can drift or overdo things sometimes. But I have always felt reassured by the fact that  Khenchen Rinpoche can follow the translation quite well and indeed sometimes he did correct me. But since it does not happen often, it makes me feel that I probably deliver the meaning of the original text correctly. If sometimes I over-emphasize something, it is because I really put my heart into it. My aim is to inspire people and keep them interested. 

You and other translators offer your service for free, right?

Yes, this is our offering to the sangha. And it is true that when I translate, I cannot enjoy the teaching in the same way as when I just listen and contemplate on what was said. Originally, I did not talk about it as  a work but actually, it is a work, you have to be very alert and conceptually active all the time. And sometimes I do feel quite tired after translating, especially when I did both the morning and afternoon sessions. I realized that I really had to get enough sleep to restore my energy. 

Pictures: Jitka Polanská